World Map according to China in 1799.

  1. What do maps from other cartographers (e.g. Indian, European,...) of that time look like`? The comparison would be interesting.

  2. Yea I totally wanna see an old map from India, because they are always extremely shrinked down on both European maps and this Chinese one.

  3. European maps would be much much more accurate, not sure about other societies but this was long after most of the rest of the world has been discovered by Europeans.

  4. I would highlight that this was not a map used for navigation, but rather propaganda purposes "we are bigger therefore more important than the others".

  5. I find this kind of post title misleading and really encourages implicit bias. Edit: is this their best map at the time? Or just one map?

  6. As others have said, this map is art, not for navigating. It would be likened to aliens in the far away future after we're extinct finding a map of the world from a children's book with animals and shit and thinking we're shitty cartographers.

  7. Maps made by seafarers tended to be fairly accurate in terms of where land masses are in relation to each other and less accurate about all other aspects. Modern maps meant for navigation still do that to some degree. The Mercator projection makes Antarctica seem like it's the size of Africa but it's the most iconic projection because it preserves the angles between points on the map, so it was perfect for sailors.

  8. Probably because Blue is a man-made dye and was very costly during those days. That's one of the reasons why you hardly see blue flags or army uniforms from the middle ages.

  9. This map is probably inspired by the world maps produced by the jesuits in China since the 17th century. Jesuits cartographers had the clever idea to put China on the center or near-center of the map, so that their world map were well received. While local Chinese cartographers would perhaps avoid inaccuracies regarding Chinese territories, there would be less incentives for Japan, which is not always pictured very well in 17th and 18th European maps.

  10. Surely it is detailed but in an exploded view in the same way the other areas around china are enlarged

  11. Jesuits were crawling all over the Ming and later Qing Dynasty courts serving as foreign ambassadors, scientists, and advisers to the Emperors about all things outside of China.

  12. What is the source of this map? Am interested in the style of this map which I find the colors, shading and gradients styles interesting for that era. 1799 would be during the Qianlong era.

  13. I like how the Netherlands is absolutely massive on this map. Perhaps the European part of the map could be titled A Chinese Map of Europe According to the Dutch lol.

  14. This can't have been their official map. With all the trade of goods and knowledge along the silk road during that time, I don't believe their brightest cartographers actually thought the world looked like this. This looks like it might have been made by some grade school teacher from that era, being used today as anti-Chinese propaganda, but not what was used by the emperor to make international decisions. Don't believe everything on the internet, people.

  15. The title should be ‘This is one Chinese artist’s pretty shitty interpretation of the world’. No way anybody in China would have used this in any meaningful sense.

  16. Whatever they got from foreigners, even if super crude, is better than their own land depiction. This can't possibly the best thing they had by 1799, or is it?

  17. It's not. An actual map from that time was linked in another comment. And it's a detailed and thorough as you might imagine for thr late 1700s.

  18. For real, i can't even find 湖北 despite knowing exactly where it is. Wish there was a better photo but even so, it seems very sparse.

  19. Im really concerned about wording with these types of things, its a map in Chinese but what do you mean by according to China? Chinese people are not some homogenous mass that any single representation suddenly represents all chinese people. People don’t treat most other groups like this. Is this the official Qing Dynasty Map used by the Qing government? Is is some random Chinese person? Wtf is China? A guy named China? If i show any map from this period in English is it the map According to England?

  20. Even besides the inaccuracy, this seems Ike a really useless map. it looks more like a decoration piece with the pattern of a world map than a real tool for navigation. I can’t imagine that this is the best they had for the rest of the world.

  21. The china hate is strong in this thread. If you do a reverse image search of this, you can see it’s meant to be an eastern hemisphere map, so that’s why there’s no America. Keep in mind that Chinese scientists knew the world was round going back very far, and they discovered America a long time before this map was made.

  22. That still dosent change the fact that this map is comedicly shit and that the Chinese were to full of themselves to take intrest in the world around them wich was being dominated bye the European.

  23. Can anyone tell me if the Sikh empire is there (as it existed at this time but I'm not sure if it was even bordering China yet like it later would) and what they called it?

  24. This may be a map from 1799 but similar world maps used in China go back to the 5th and 6th century. There are even some that say archaeological evidence exists that suggests the Chinese traded all along South America before the Inca Empire fell. This is basically a navigational trade map. It's not ment to be accurate world map.

  25. Those who are questioning why this map look so inaccurate for a 1700s map is because this map isn’t even an official map. Probably drawn by some random teacher or traveler. There are much more detailed and accurate maps out there dating way far back. I’m just assuming OP either purposely made this misleading or that they’re just not educated enough to think one of the worlds oldest and most inventive country does not know how to make maps.

  26. This isn't even the offical map used by the government, this is like getting some random map in history and saying it was offical. It's not and they knew the America's existed at this time.

  27. What's the primary source for Chinese mapmakers?--they weren't exactly great explorers. Did they just copy western maps, like they copy everything else today?

  28. Where have you read that they’re not good explorers? Considering how they dominated trade and expanded reach, historians state they’re quite good at exploring.

  29. Thread is a testament to how white people are sponges to propaganda despite circlejerking themselves as free thinkers. No wonder 90% of anti-vaxxers are white. Need to feed ego outweighs actual facts. Good reference for demonstrating implicit/subconscious maintenance of white supremacy.

  30. Dude it’s a hotel in China. It’s purpose is to display the time. Of course they put China in the center. It’s not purely a map, it’s just a cool looking clock.

  31. If you're referring to the large blob on the lower right, I think that's supposed to donate Australia. There appears to be another landmass jutting up under Africa. It's possible that they still followed old European tales of

  32. Not really. The Mercator projection is designed for navigation and preserves accurate cardinal directions at the expense of proportional area because that’s what’s important for charting courses. It’s a very useful map projection and the inflation of polar extremes is an inevitable consequence not a deliberate choice. Mercator didn’t just decide to make a map where Greenland was huge for shits and giggles.

  33. Awesome map as well as culture. Don’t take today’s China as a reference as the culture is extremely rich.

  34. Is this fake maybe? I know that China at the time was very far behind Europe, but this map is comically awful for 1799. Did they seriously not have any European maps made in the last century hanging around when they decided to make this one?

  35. Lol how the hell did they manage to not know where India was or how huge it is but know relatively where Britain was? Prob because Europeans visited there and told them

  36. China has been trading with the Philippines even before 1500 (pre Spanish colonization of Philippines). I doubt this map is what Chinese seafarers used.

  37. The massive size of China might not just be the map maker’s daily in this map, but instead Chinese propaganda. The Qing emperors were said to rule “everything under heaven” and during the Opium wars called the British “rebels”, because to them everyone was destined to live under the rule of the Emperor.

  38. Despite the Chinese importing silver from the Americas for over 200 years at this point, they apparently had no clue what it actually looked like.

  39. So backwards compared to contemporary European made maps of which had pretty much the entire planet with the only distortion being the poles where the ice mad things ambiguous. Not good for navigation not even remotely accurate this is primitive garbage and shows it's inferiority. It looks like a child saw a world map and tried to copy it.

  40. The Chinese really thought Korea was part of them from back in the days. What the fuck. I am not surprised as a Korean.

  41. At first I was astonished ancient China had a world map so good, and then I looked at the date, I’m so embarrassed on chinas behalf.

  42. Is the green in this the ocean? And white is land? I’m guessing that’s why where China should be it’s golden coloured instead?

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