Judge allows Wisconsin Hospital to prevent its AT-WILL employees from accepting better offers at a competing hospital by granting injunction to prevent them from starting new positions on Monday. How is this legal? We should be able to work wherever we want!!! Hospitals do not own Us!!!

  1. Hey all, there's a lot of emotions surrounding this topic. This will be your only reminder to be adults and play nice in the sandbox.

  2. They’re literally not even suing to keep them, they’re suing to not allow them to work at the other hospital. As of right now, per the judges order, they cannot work at either hospital. Completely pointless. So….fuck anybody who has a stroke in Wisconsin this week, I suppose?

  3. Wow! I have no words. This is beyond reprehensible. I can't believe a judge would think this is okay for ANY profession, but especially with healthcare professionals now.

  4. No, the injunction is only against Acension. Ascension must either (1) delay their hire, or (2) make them available to the former employer. So if the former employer doesn't give them a shift, Ascension is free to use them, as they were 'available'. Regardless, the injunction is only against the new employer. The employees can do whatever, get a job at a third employer and tell nobody, whatever.

  5. I've seen non-compete clauses before but those are typically in fields where there is proprietary IP. I dont think there are any secrets in nursing. this is just plain stupid.

  6. I guess you can keep me from going to the new job, but you can't force me to go to work at the old job. We're not slaves yet. Hope I've got some savings for my few days off, because fuck you.

  7. Also, make sure you read what you sign when you start working. Look for any language that says you will not work for competing hospitals/companies in the area and strike it.

  8. I'm just realising that THIS is why the offers coming out of this state are $150/hour and up. I think I saw one in the 200s range.

  9. How they gonna keep their employee? If i was working there and saw what just happened, i would be job hunting really fucking fast.

  10. The injunction is against Ascension (the company that hired the nurses). They have to either share the employees or not hire the nurses.

  11. I have worked with execs from for-profit health systems, and I can tell you that this is dead-on for them. One told me they do as much as legally required not to be sued AND make money. No mention of the patient.

  12. What do you know about that website? Is it associated with a particular union? Otherwise I'm a little hesitant to give my info out to a website stating im in interested in organizing a union at my workplace.

  13. I can't believe you guys don't have a good nurses union. Here in Australia the ANU is one of the most powerful unions in the country and is one union no employer ever messes with. I only wish our healthcare professionals (radiographers, physios, OT, etc) union was half as powerful

  14. And now that they are benefitting the employees by showing they have leverage and power, the companies want them stopped.

  15. How are they suppose to hire new staff when they are waving enough red flags that even someone colorblind could see them? Who would want to work in such a toxic environment

  16. Exactly. Their moment of greed will have permanent, lasting damage to their reputation. I'm really interested to hear from people who work there currently in other departments. I would not want to continue working for management like that.

  17. Even if I already worked there and saw management doing this to other people, I'd tell them to fuck right off. Nursing jobs are PLENTIFUL and very high paying. Especially since COVID and them deciding to fire people who can't get vaccinated for one reason or another.

  18. It's not gonna hold up and now both facilities are now short on staffing. This judge used to threaten minors in court so the more attention this case gets, the more likely it'll get rectified

  19. If they start blatantly forcing labor like this, that's all the fuel people will need to agitate a general strike.

  20. They will likely be able to counter-sue the organization for lost wages due to this. The question becomes if its financially worth it to do so.

  21. The only ones salivating more are the employment lawyers that are already preparing for the cases against the hospital.

  22. They’re not suing their employees trying to force them to stay. They’re suing ascension to try and make it so they can’t hire the “thedacare 7.” It’s not going to stick.

  23. Friend of a friend (a physician) was threatened a lawsuit in a major Houston hospital if were to leave and not provide adequate notice. He had to give 10 months notice. This happened like 2-3 weeks back.

  24. You misunderstand. They arent suing the employees they're suing the other hospital. Basically Thedacare is claiming damages because Amita or whoever it was hired people who were working for thedacare. The byproduct was an injunction preventing the former employees from working the new job. I do not believe it prevents them from working for another company entirely. Also I expect that if thedacare and the other company havent worked this out by monday the judge is going to throw this case right the fuck out the window.

  25. Late stage capitalism, it's doing everything in it's power to maintain unattainable levels of profit growth and in doing do is causing it's own demise

  26. Great for them until they realise they are getting zero applications for future vacancies. Who would choose to take a job with any company who did this?

  27. I first discovered collapse in like 2018 when an extremely alarming climate change report came out. I had to unsubscribe only because it was giving me such anxiety but it all made sense. Four years later and yeah I’m pretty sure they’re right

  28. I would literally starve to death in a gutter before I would go back to that old hospital, wtf is this even supposed to accomplish besides punishing people for taking a better paying job?

  29. I'm still not fully understanding how an at-will state is seriously allowing a company who can fire people at-will to tell people they can't go work somewhere else.

  30. So this ruling was against Ascension. Ascension is barred from hiring the 7 nurses, 4 of which were going to start Monday. So those nurses can't start at Ascension until the injunction is lifted.

  31. It’s not legal, the judge apparently has a history of off the wall decisions. It is completely unenforceable. I saw on other threads that they were told to go ahead and report to the new job anyway because it’s unenforceable.

  32. That’s good. I figured it was mostly a bluff, but it’s still an insane move. Terrible PR and a huge waste of money, all while providing the actual complete opposite of patient care. American healthcare is the best in the world!!

  33. This judge is nuts, I read that he put someone in jail for 42 days for rolling their eyes in the courtroom. I hope he doesn't issue bench warrants for these personnel for 'contempt' or something ridiculous

  34. Honestly I think this is the kind of publicity we needed. This is plastered all over the world now, for everyone to see what kinda shady stuff goes down. I think this case will set a new bar and encourage HCWs to fight back. That and thedacare is going to tank. I can’t wait to see Q1 earnings. I bet this will cause a mass exodus from thedacare. CEO just singlehandedly brought down an entire hospital. If I were a board member I would’ve already called an emergency meeting and pushed to fire the idiot.

  35. Sooo I found their contact on their website. I just so happened to link it below. Not that I encourage anyone to use this link to contact them and fully speak your mind. Stay safe!!!

  36. Not a nurse, but work in mental health. I posted in solidarity with you all. I'm sorry these jackasses are doing this.

  37. This is fucking ridiculous. The free market and capitalism only works when it’s in the favor of the c-suite. We need to organize and conduct a nation wide strike.

  38. I think the injunction was against the other hospital to stop them from hiring the nurses until the case was heard. Still don’t know how it would be enforceable.

  39. There is a surprising number of people supportive of neo-feudalism out there. They’re typically people who would not end up at the top, of course

  40. Bye, Felicia. I’ll take my chances on unemployment. Now neither of you bitch asses can have me. The fuck.

  41. Since always the 14th amendment frees people from being able to be owned by private citizens but leaves government/corporate forced labor (slavery) intact.

  42. How much did the facility get from the Provider Relief Fund? Mine got 39 million. Surely they got something they could of offered to thier employees. I would attach the link here to look up individual facilities but I am still trying to figure out how.

  43. man i wish i could read the in-house emails at thedacare right now, the bullshit they must be sending to their current staff explaining the situation and media scrutiny.

  44. There's been nothing to all staff since the one Thursday that ended up being posted here. I'm expecting something tomorrow, and I'm sure it'll be a doozy.

  45. Holy shit something needs to happen to the people doing this shit. We need things changed bad there's no time for tolerance and giving them the benefit of the doubt: they are evil. There is nothing redeemable about these CEOs. They are a net negative in every way to society. There is no reasoning, there should be no tolerance, and there should be no consideration for them. You're on the fast track to indentured servitude.

  46. Thedacare is hopefully learning an expensive lesson. I checked out their Facebook page. It’s hilarious. Their post,” When should you go to your doctor, versus urgent care versus emergency room.

  47. Guaranteed that judge is at home right now getting updates on our collective outrage and thinking “oh shit, probably shouldn’t have done that”.

  48. Maybe this question is naive on my part to ask, but can the judge's ruling/decision realistically be enforced? Or can the nurses just be like "lol no thx and still go work wherever they please?

  49. The order isn't against the nurses, but against Ascension. It basically says A can't have these staff work for them; not that the staff can't work.

  50. Citizens United said that money = free speech. We’re on our way to corporations running the entire nation that’s due the absolutely spineless Congress and the Supreme Court which now made up of 5 extra right-wing senators and two judges.

  51. The state of politics is disgusting in USA. We wanna act like other countries threaten us when we are our own worst enemy.

  52. Not a nurse but want to chime in that it is legit and that the person who organized it is in touch with their attorneys. Also gofundme is good about making sure their donations go to the intended target.

  53. No patients would trust anyone forced to work somewhere especially having a cardiovascular/interventional radiology procedure done. Shame on Thedacare!

  54. Is anyone else concerned with how the case itself was presented to the court? Thedacare effectively argued that the community would be negatively affected by the transition of workers from Thedacare to Ascension.

  55. I'm not sure how this can be legal? I imagine it will be challenged in court. Professionals are allowed to work where they please. I would resign from my position. They can't force me to report to work.

  56. Just another example of our broken legal system. Just because you didn't do anything wrong doesn't mean that can't mess up your life.

  57. They are not being forced to return to work at their old jobs, but the judge has ruled that they cannot work at their new jobs on Monday. So they are out of work. I believe the judge said that the two hospitals are supposed to come to an agreement on Monday?And in the meantime I am not sure what they plan to do about, you know, their patients.

  58. This reminds me of the saying “your poor planning is not my emergency” I get that patients lives are at stake but they should have thought of that when they had the opportunity to counter offer or maybe they should have treated their staff better and paid them better before they were up shits creek. I know most National Guard trained medical staff have their own jobs but don’t we have active duty military they can put to work here if they don’t want to get competitive?

  59. They didn't even poach them. One employee applied at hospital B, and told their coworkers about the better pay/work-life balance. The other six applied to open positions and accepted them.

  60. Complete BS!! NO ONE has the right or privilege to determine who I work for, when I work for them, how much I'll make or when I make it. If I want to work somewhere else I will. If I want to leave somewhere this is usually a sign of an underlying issue with the current place. Why would you want to keep an employee that isn't happy???

  61. So basically we learned something important here. If you are an RN, CNA, LPN, etc. Stay out of Wisconsin if you value your autonomy.

  62. This has a possibility to completely alter the nature of employment in the USA as we know it. They aren't arguing against anti-trust or illegal back door deals or non-compete issues here. They are saying to the staff "You are not allowed to quit and leave because we need you for our purposes. But, we can still terminate you whenever we see fit."

  63. Every nurse in Wisconsin should walk off the job on Monday in solidarity. Tell these greedy CEOs who are sitting back right now licking their chops to FUCK OFF! I’d rather quit my RN job and work for minimum wage before I’d succumb to this utter bullshit.

  64. A nurse on here made a post a couple days ago on here of a letter from their CEO that talked about doing just this…could they be one in the same hospitals!?!?

  65. Since when is it legal for the gov to tell you where you can and can’t work? Since when does a corporation’s needs legally outweigh an individual’s?

  66. https://www.postcrescent.com/story/news/2022/01/21/what-we-know-ascension-thedacare-court-battle-over-employees/6607417001/

  67. The article is pretty damning. The nurses had zero obligation to ask Thedacare to start valuing them and match the offers by Ascension. It was already clear prior to that point Ascension does not actually care about nurses. So it was huge of the soon-to-be ex employees to ask Thedacare to match the wages offered by Ascension. These nurses went above and beyond before even leaving.

  68. damn this is SAD... So next taking it to next level and quit or get fired for no show at work then apply at new hospital?

  69. This. Is. Wisconsin. Cross-posted this nonsense over there to see what the fellow Wisconsinites had to say about it. Apparently this judge is on record as something of an asshole. Apart from this corporate collusion.

  70. at this point, almost wanna say fuck it, go and defy that injunction. one way or another, never fucking work at that goddamn shithole again whether it's because you're at your new job or in jail for contempt - because this shit is literally contemptible.

  71. You must not know much about the history of labor laws in this country. Did you know that for a longer period of time it was illegal to unionize than its been legal to unionize? Ever heard of that massacre where a sheriff deputized 100 citizens and they straight up murdered a fuck ton of people trying to make a decent living by striking? And you’re surprised this is happening?

  72. This is not really about these seven employees. Thedacare already knows that they won’t be working there a month from now or even a week from now, regardless of how the court case works out. They already signalled that they see these people as disposable assets when they refused to pay market wages.

  73. It’s called head hunting/poaching and businesses have been doing that forever .. never heard individuals don’t have the right to follow the best deals.... imagine if this happened with sports stars... oh of course it wouldn’t.. it’s just health care workers that don’t seem to be able to bargain for the best contracts.

  74. Exactly this, the judges ruling makes it sound like they are talking about objects, like maybe equipment or something. Not humans with free will. The judge tells the two hospitals to work out a deal. But it's over employees. Who are humans with free will. Who don't "belong" to either hospital, and have no obligation to work at either. Unless this is indentured servitude or something, how a judge could ever say this is beyond me. It's shocking. Two hospitals don't have a right to make any deal about where their employees get to work. People have always been free to decide that.

  75. It’s legal because every four years you ALL decide that you want all these ridiculous things. You live in a country of masochists and YOU are one of them. You always do this and you will absolutely 100% continue to do so. Stop complaining if you’re not prepared to do anything and get into like playing guitar or cooking or reading or something. Much better for your mental health.

  76. Keep voting for republicans, and this is what you get. This all-encompassing concept that corporations are the glory of god and employees are disposable widgets drives this disgusting mindset where profits are the only point to life.

Leave a Reply

Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *

You may have missed